The Muon improvement suggestions thread.

[Snowhog]

I like Muon, and am actually running a 'custom' compiled from git (?) version with the help of the developer. However, and not as a dis to Muon, I don't use it (nor did I use any other graphical package manager) to do the installing/removing/upgrading of packages on my system -- I use the CLI and apt-get, using the --simulate option before 'doing the deed'. I keep a log of all such package changes. I have never had a problem doing it this way.

[vw72]

An observation from 12.04:
I usually do the daily updates through the Konsole and apt-get and during the past week I had on two occasions a package held back from upgrading.
When I tried Muon it suggested to install or update a few dependencies and all became well.

So it looks to me that Muon has made some great strides to becoming a one-stop solution for package management.

Kudos to the developer!!!

I would agree with this. Muon has matured and become very stable. Now if they would only add it to the system settings dialog.

[Snowhog]

I would agree with this. Muon has matured and become very stable. Now if they would only add it to the system settings dialog.

?? Muon Software Center and Muon Package Manager appear under System by default.

[vw72]

?? Muon Software Center and Muon Package Manager appear under System by default.

It does in the classic menu, but using the default menu, the system settings brings up a dialog box and muon doesn appear there.

[SteveRiley]

One feature I'd love to see: displaying all the actual installation work in a text window, like Synaptic. For me, the primary reason I prefer the command line is I like to monitor what the package manager is doing. If something fails, I have a good idea of what actions to take. Muon conceals all that behind a big blue thermometer bar.

[Snowhog]

It does in the classic menu, but using the default menu, the system settings brings up a dialog box and muon doesn appear there.

It does here, on 12.04.

[vw72]

It does here, on 12.04.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]3127[/ATTACH]

I know it is in the menu. I want it in the system settings dialog -- the thing that looks like the Windows Control Center.

[bra|10n]

One feature I'd love to see: displaying all the actual installation work in a text window, like Synaptic. For me, the primary reason I prefer the command line is I like to monitor what the package manager is doing. If something fails, I have a good idea of what actions to take. Muon conceals all that behind a big blue thermometer bar.

+1

I would have replicated Synaptic's feature set as a base for Muon and then built on additional features over time that enhanced the application further.

[JontheEchidna]

One feature I'd love to see: displaying all the actual installation work in a text window, like Synaptic. For me, the primary reason I prefer the command line is I like to monitor what the package manager is doing. If something fails, I have a good idea of what actions to take. Muon conceals all that behind a big blue thermometer bar.

The reasons behind not showing this have been technical limitations. Synaptic runs APT as a fork of its own process, and has access to the file descriptors that apt/dpkg use for the console output. It then uses a virtual terminal emulator as a "seat" for these file descriptors and uses this vt to facilitate I/O between the GUI and apt. There's some very old-school Unix black magic at play here.

Muon uses LibQApt's QApt Worker to run commits and other things that require administrative access. (This is why Muon itself can be run without administrative rights) A byproduct of this is that the dpkg process is no longer a fork of our own process, and we have limited access to the file descriptors it uses for dpkg output. Due to this, we can't just have a terminal emulator like the Konsole KPart run in Muon's GUI read/write to this file descriptor to get the raw dpkg output. Recently I did find out that if we set up a PTY inside of the QApt Worker, we could read the raw dpkg output and send it across DBus, but this is the very raw dpkg output complete with terminal control characters. I've not yet found the best way to deal with this, and I don't really want to create my own virtual terminal emulator to properly format the output.

So, I would like to implement this feature, when I can figure out how. :P

[JontheEchidna]

I would agree with this. Muon has matured and become very stable. Now if they would only add it to the system settings dialog.

This likely won't happen. Package Management isn't really a "setting", so it doesn't really belong in System Settings. Not to mention that doing so would require a significant rewrite of the Muon GUI itself. It's a shame that KPackageKit/Apper set this precedent.

[SteveRiley]

So, I would like to implement this feature, when I can figure out how. :P

Thanks for the explanation. We all very much appreciate it when developers, busy as you must be, take a few moments to offer brief bits of such detail.

[tomcloyd]

two persistent bugs, and a suggestion

I've lost count of the number of times I've installed Muon, used it, and given up. I'm about to do it again. I'm sad about this, because there are many things I truly like about it. I trust someday it will just work. I really hope so. So...my two bugs, prefaced with a suggestion:

First of all - why, when I type "muon" into the K-launcher, get THREE responses - update manager, package manager, and software center. This is simply confusing. I have to figure out which one to launch, and a non-trivial percent of the time I get it wrong. I MUCH prefer the Synaptic way: one interface, multiple functions available via toolbar and menu functions. "Don't make me think!" Splitting the functionality at the program level is actually the wrong choice, psychologically, I think.

Bugs:

1. Can't run update. Right now, Muon simply isn't usable, and I don't know why. I start with a notification in the system tray that I have updates. Clicking this, I get the Muon Update Manager. Clicking "install updates" on the toolbar, I then get this message: "Another application seems to be using the package system at this time. You must close all other package managers before you will be able to install or remove any packages." This is nuts. I've just rebooted, in an attempt to clear whatever is running that's causing Muon to think this (I was getting this message BEFORE I rebooted, too). Right after the bootup, I launch Muon, and then get this. I have NO idea why. I cannot fix it. Time to bail, and once again launch Synaptic, which...just works.

2. Muon cannot shut down. I see this routinely right after I do a manual check-for-updates. The check runs, the progress bar moves to the far right, and reads "100%"...then we just sit there. I have to blow off the program, relaunch, and THEN can (usually) run the install updates function. The really exasperating thing about this is that I've been having this can't-shut-down problem with Muon for at least 6 months - essentially right from the beginning. Don't know why. And this isn't the only context in which this problem is seen.

Hope this helps somehow. I look forward to the day we can have full functionality with Muon. That'll be great!

[vw72]

The reason you get three muons, is that krunner is listing anything that begins with what you are typing. Since they all begin with muon, all three are listed.

As for bugs, it sounds like you have a locked file. Open a terminal and type: sudo apt-get install -f If you get an error message about a lock file existing, go ahead and manually delete it (you will probably need to sudo rm <followed by the path to the file>. Then run sudo apt-get install -f again.

As for muon being stuck, that usually happens after there has been an error. Again, open a terminal and type killall muon and see if that fixes it.

I will say that, like you, I had many problems with muon prior to the version in 12.04. It is as different as night and day.

[Teunis]

You could start by right clicking the launcher and selecting the Classical one and see if it makes for a more transparent experience.

As vw72 says, there's most likely a stale lock file that needs manual removal, when you click Details in the Muon error window it should inform you of such.
Such a lock file remains when the program is shut down through unconventional means like a crash.

I have been using Muon for about a year now and rarely need the Konsole with apt-get, the main trick is to read the various warnings, the status etc. before committing.

[bra|10n]

@tomcloyd

First of all - why, when I type "muon" into the K-launcher, get THREE responses - update manager, package manager, and software center. This is simply confusing.

Stop typing Muon into Klauncher and instead replace the entry for muon-software center with muon-package manager in Kickoff's "Computer" tab by typing the following into Krunner;

kdesu kate /usr/share/kubuntu-default-settings/kde4-profile/default/share/config/kickoffrc

and change the muon-installer.desktop entry to read muon.desktop in kickoffrc, then close.

1. Can't run update. Right now, Muon simply isn't usable, and I don't know why. I start with a notification in the system tray that I have updates. Clicking this, I get the Muon Update Manager. Clicking "install updates" on the toolbar, I then get this message: "Another application seems to be using the package system at this time.

sudo /usr/lib/update-notifier/update-motd-updates-available --force

in a konsole about 5 mins after start-up should do the trick.

Restart you system.

2. Muon cannot shut down. I see this routinely right after I do a manual check-for-updates.

This issue too should be resolved with the above suggestions.

Good luck.