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    #1

    Partition questions

    I have several partition questions:

    1. I have a 500g HD with not much on it (win2000 install. feisty, 2g extended, swap and data). I intend to add more partitions, in particular for a clone of Feisty as a backup preparatory to upgrading. Am I correct in determining the maximum unused space available and then enlarging the extended partition to that size so I can create logical partitions in it as desired?

    2. The /home in feisty is not on a separate partition. Apparently it is preferable to put it on a separate partition, and I have a link which will help me do it if I want. What happens when I want to install other linux installs and have /home partitions for each-- how what keeps track of which goes with which?

    3. If I delete a partition with gparted. does the partition numbering get changed and if so, is it automatically adjusted in relevant files, eg fstab?
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    #2
    Re: Partition questions

    1 In GParted, Partition > Move/Re-size, you will be shown the maximum possible to resize the Extended partition – just accept it.

    2 You have to keep track of all the separate homes. Or, perhaps, some distros won't have separate homes (?). Based on the few cases I've seen, may not be a good idea to share the same /home between two or more distros (it's possible, but has risks & complications).

    3 GParted will adjust & renumber the partitions. No, fstab will not know about it. You'll have to edit fstab; also edit menu.lst because the UUIDs will change (or, if they ARE effected, then edit menu.lst).
    When you first re-boot, after messing with partitions, you'll get “Unable to resolve UUID=etc” and just hit Ctrl+D and Enter (maybe twice if it doesn't go the first time) to get past the error and to boot into your Kubuntu (then edit fstab with corrections). (blkid at Konsole gives you the UUIDs.)



    EDIT -- Yes, make Extended the maximum possible.

    EDIT (#2) -- Each separate distro you install will keep track of which home belongs to it (set up in fstab); each will know where your home is when you are using that distro; but you must keep track of all this also. In each distro, you will be able to mount your other homes and copy/paste data back and forth between the various homes.

    Best to think it through carefully to allow maximal flexibility.
    Example: You install a distro for curiosity or experiments, so you don't need a separate home for it. But later, you decide you will use the distro and want a separate home. Then you must have the flexibility to make one (on a separate, partition).
    Example: You make a separate home for a distro, but later decide you want to expand the size of that home; then you need the space to do so.

    Seems, in particular, that homes should be placed in Logicals, following the root partitions (which can be relatively much smaller, like 5GB-15GB, usually around 8 GB on average it seems). Perhaps put a swap partition (to be used y all distros) either among the first 3 primary partitions or as the first Logical partition, sda5 (since it won't change and also you want it out of the way in case you are enlarging other Logical partitions or making new Logicals).

    That sort of thinking.
    An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski
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      #3
      Re: Partition questions

      Thanks again, Mike. Another question, what is your feeling about separate /home's. As I understand it, separate /homes are desirable because of a) security questions, which I don't understand; b)if a fresh install is necessary, you will still have /home. But how difficult is it to save a backup of /home and restore it to new install?; c) corruption of / could infect /home. Again a backup should suffice. Am I wrong in going for no separate /home and doing upgrades so that all the tweaking will be taken care of, and only do a fresh install with backups relatively rarely. I am going to use your suggestion of the previous thread about cloning Feisty to a separate partition and adjusting grub so I can boot off this partition before I upgrade.
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        #4
        Re: Partition questions

        Separate /home partitions for an installed OS is desireable. Should the root ( / ) file system become corrupted, and you are forced to reinstall, your user settings and files in /home are untouched. If you do not create a separate /home partition, and the root file system becomes corrupted and you are forced to reinstall, you must backup your /home directory or you loose everthing.

        This is how my main HD is setup:
        Code:
        Disk /dev/sda: 120.0 GB, 120034123776 bytes
255 heads, 63 sectors/track, 14593 cylinders, total 234441648 sectors
Units = sectors of 1 * 512 = 512 bytes
Disk identifier: 0xc528b3c5

 Device Boot   Start    End   Blocks Id System
/dev/sda1 *     63  16771859  8385898+ 83 Linux
/dev/sda2    16771860  33543719  8385930 83 Linux
/dev/sda3    33543720  50315579  8385930 83 Linux
/dev/sda4    50315580 180345689  65015055  5 Extended
/dev/sda5    50315643  92261294  20972826 83 Linux
/dev/sda6    92261358 134207009  20972826 83 Linux
/dev/sda7   134207073 176152724  20972826 83 Linux
/dev/sda8   176152788 180345689  2096451 82 Linux swap / Solaris
        I have Feisty's root file system installed on sda1 with it's /home partition on sda5. Gutsy's root file system is installed on sda2 with it's /home partition on sda6. sda3 and sda7 are empty at the moment, but are set up for a third Linux OS. sda8 is the common swap partition for the installed OS's.
        Using Kubuntu Linux since March 23, 2007
        "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data." - Sherlock Holmes​
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          #5
          Re: Partition questions

          So is a good and timely backup of /home just as good as a separate /home. I am thinking of keeping any data in a separate partition so that /home doesn't get updated very often, but perhaps /home gets updated a lot even if it only has the usual program data. Isn't /etc almost as important?
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            #6
            Re: Partition questions

            “Am I wrong in going for no separate /home and doing upgrades so that all the tweaking will be taken care of, and only do a fresh install with backups relatively rarely.”

            I'm not sure what you mean.


            “I am going to use your suggestion of the previous thread about cloning Feisty to a separate partition and adjusting grub so I can boot off this partition before I upgrade.”

            And in that case, you can backup your root only (if root is separate from home) or the root+home (if they are on the same partition)--lots of flexibility on this. (And always, make separate backups of any important home data.) However, if you want to clone an OS to use on a separate partition, then it seems that having home on the same partition as root is much easier.

            I'm not sure these questions have definitive answers. It may be personal preference.
            I have an orphaned home partition right now, with good data on it, and that I use; but the root Kubuntu OS for that home (which was separate) got demo-ed (wrecked). I also have a good Kubuntu on another partition with its separate home that I'm using (at least until I manage to wreck it, too). I keep a separate Kubuntu somewhere on the disks with included or separate home, to use for experiments. If I trash my regular “good” Kubuntu (that has a separate home), I then switch to using the experimental Kubuntu as my regular “good” Kubuntu. Gets complicated. I end up with OSs all over two disks, and several flash drives, and one or more homes laying around with good data on them. Also, I never upgrade to the next version using Adept; I always install fresh.

            This is definitely a subject where it is illuminating to get different user views/habits, and we have members here who do all sorts of things with 1 or 2 or 3 disks and several OSs. If you are not in a hurry, I'd give myself some time to explore the options. There aren't too many absolute rights or wrongs on this, I don't think.

            I'm happy to pitch in here with my opinions/experience, but keep in mind you are asking someone who trashes an OS about once every 3-5 days, on average ... usually, intentionally (toad, don't say it ...)
            (But I do believe in the * theory * of backups ...)

            An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski
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              #7
              Re: Partition questions

              Think of it this way. System files and configurations are kept within the root file system - in and under /. Each user on your system has their settings and configurations in /home/username All customization, as a user, that you do, are reflected in settings files/configuration files within that user's /home/username directory.

              The /etc directory is under / and not part of the user's directory. If you are concerned about backing up, and you have the space, then backup the root filesystem ( / ) as well as the separate /home partition (basically, your entire system). If you have a separate /home partition, and you find your self in the unfortunate position of having to perform a reinstall, all you have to do is install all the updates (which could take some time), but afterwards, you would have your system back 'as you had it' before reinstalling.
              Using Kubuntu Linux since March 23, 2007
              "It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data." - Sherlock Holmes​
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                #8
                Re: Partition questions

                Yes, you'd have to have timely/frequent backups of your home. For example, all your Firefox (bookmarks) and email profiles are on your home. All sorts of application settings are on your home. You have to remember to make a backup of home before doing anything that might trash your OS.

                I keep a good, regular Kubuntu with a separate home, and in that home partition, I put an image of the root partition; I trash the root OS, then restore easily from that backup image I've stashed in home, and everything hooks up fine. Plus the experimental OSs I mentioned above.

                What you need to remember to do is to keep important browser & email program profiles backed up; e.g., on flash drives. (As well as, of course, ALL your personal data like that, but your bookmarks and email addresses are very useful & important in a crisis--worst case, you can easily import them--drag-and-drop if need be--to a live Kubuntu CD session.)

                I also keep Kubuntu on a live persistent flash drive, with backups of bookmarks & email on a separate flash drive.
                An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski
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                  #9
                  Re: Partition questions

                  ahurd, perhaps this might help to give an example of one way one user does it (me, at the moment).
                  It reflects my current line of thinking, given a certain set of objectives.

                  sda 160 GB Seagate SATA
                  GRUB is installed to the MBR of sda and BIOS boots first from sda.
                  sda1 Windows XP 100 GB
                  sda2 A small dedicated GRUB partition in case I need it (100 MB) (but not used)
                  -Lots of room left on this 160 GB disk-

                  sdb Linux drive, another 160 Seagate SATA
                  GRUB is installed (as a precaution) to the MBR of sdb AND to the boot sector of each Linux root partition installed on sdb.
                  sdb1 Small dedicate GRUB partition (a second one) – the MAIN GRUB that has the main menu.lst for booting all OSs on sda & sdb.
                  sdb2 Root partition of main (production) Kubuntu OS that I use all the time. 8 GB
                  sdb3 Root partition for another Kubuntu OS (experimental, next alpha/beta release, etc.) 8 GB
                  sdb4 Extended partition
                  sdb5 a fixed swap partition, to be used by all OSs -- 2 GB (too big, but I've got plenty of room)
                  sdb6 /home for the OS on sdb2. Contains a backup image of the sdb2 root partition.
                  sdb7 /home for the OS on sdb3. Contains a backup image of the sdb3 root partition.
                  sdb8++ -- room for ad hoc OS installations/experiments; OSs here may or may not have separate /homes.

                  -- External USB HDD, Seagate SATA 320 GB--as needed for experiments, extra OSs, etc.
                  (GRUB installed to its MBR and to each OS root partition.)
                  -- Various bootable flash drives including one very good Live persistent Kubuntu complete setup.
                  -- Various data flash drives.
                  -- CD/DVD backups.

                  Notice that everything from sdb6 to the end of sdb is easily changeable (grow/shrink, add/delete, move) without affecting the Extended partition..
                  The menu.lst in the sdb1 GRUB partition is simple:
                  An entry for Windows XP (chainload); and a lot of entries for each other OS:
                  title Nice Linux distro on (hdx,y)=sdbx (or sdax)
                  configfile (hdx,y)/boot/grub/menu.lst

                  When I change the OS located on partition (hdx,y), I do NOT have to change this menu.lst.
                  Also, the menu.lst is not affected by kernel updates.

                  How To GRUB Methods - Toolkit
                  http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/inde...opic=3081671.0
                  --- How to make a separate “GRUB partition.” (Dedicated to the GRUB files and make your PC boot from those GRUB files.) Reply #10
                  An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski
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                    #10
                    Re: Partition questions

                    Thanks so much all. One last question: With separate /home, are all installed software and tweakings preserved in a reinstall?
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                      #11
                      Re: Partition questions

                      "With separate /home, are all installed software and tweakings preserved in a reinstall?"

                      It has been for me.

                      Your personal/custom settings (and perhapssome--not all--programs) are in your /home (as hidden files, View > Show Hidden Files), or ls -a -l.
                      Some programs are in various root directories.

                      Better let others lend some tips here, too.

                      My how-to on Privacy Cleanup has good references on the Linux filesystem hiearchy and how it's supposed to be IN THEORY, where apps are and changing/unchanging files. Wouldn't hurt to be aware of some of that. And/or have a peek into your root directory through Konqueror.
                      But if you backup the root directory, then all the progs & apps that are there can be restored, regardless of exactly where they are located; then, also, always, backup your home, too.


                      Privacy Cleanup 101
                      http://kubuntuforums.net/forums/inde....msg115011#new
                      An intellectual says a simple thing in a hard way. An artist says a hard thing in a simple way. Charles Bukowski
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