What are the Implications of Kubuntu with Wayland and Ubuntu with Mir

[kubicle]

More details on the Kubuntu plans for the next few releases:
http://vizzzion.org/blog/2013/07/the...raphics-stack/

[NoWorries]

More Anti Ubuntu News

Today I came across this report on "Has Ubuntu lost it?". This a long article that starts with the beginning of Ubuntu and the original approach where

From the beginning Ubuntu was focused on community.

It then goes on to the dvelopment of Launchpad and the comment is made that:

Four years - and a lot of criticism - after the service was first unveiled, Launchpad was open source software, but the perception remained that Ubuntu preached one thing and practiced another.

It then goes on to the adoption of Gnome followed by the location of the task bar controls from the right to the left and the compliants that were raised by doing this. The comment on Unity is that:

Unity was not the perfect solution that Canonical claimed it would be, and in fact, is just becoming stable enough for reliable use in the latest versions. One of the problems with Unity was Compiz, on which Unity was originally built and that commonly conflicted with OpenGL. It's fair to say that, technical issues aside, Unity has not been popular.

Turning now to the topic of this thread, there are many comments on the reaction to the development of Mir. For example,

Daniel Stone, contributor to X.Org (one of the base technologies without which we'd still be staring at blinking green text on a black background), put in: "I'm not worried about Wayland's future at all. I'm just irritated that this means more work for us, more work for upstream developers, more work for toolkits, and more work for hardware vendors."

The article covers the innovations that are being made to have ubuntu on phones and TV. WIth the comment that:

To innovate is to get a chance to define the future, but it comes with the risk of alienating your current users. The unique advantage desktop Linux has is that we can do both. Ubuntu can innovate while Mint, OpenSUSE, and all the others play it safe. That's the advantage of the open source ecosystem that we've built up over the years.

In these areas, my understanding is that KDE is, or will be, able to be installed on phones and tablets etc. Hopefully KDE can get more press soon.

[NoWorries]

Yes, I think the "K" would be silent as in "know". I used that just as a joke from what Steve Riley put as an option to what I had posted as an alternative desktop layout .

[verndog]

Is the "K" silent. If so then we have the Knity gritty on our hands

[NoWorries]

We should call that "KDEnity"! hahaha

Good KDEidea . While doing my daily exercise this morning, I thought another variation would be Knity.

I have been thinking lately that our SA(B)DL will become increasingly lonely as everyone but he will be using Wayland, and I also expect that Wayland will come up with a more polished product before Mir does.

[oshunluvr]

Kunity?

That might have some potential for abuse...

[SteveRiley]

We should call that "KDEnity"! hahaha

[NoWorries]

It will take a couple of releases for this to all pan out. Remember KDE3 and all the fallout over KDE4. Unity over Gnome2. I hated Unity but now that it has matured a bit, I use it over Gnome.

I have never used or considered Unity, but what I have noticed with Unity is the left panel with all the applications that can be readily launched. These can also be covered by applications but this panel is reveiled when the cursor is moved to the left edge.

Because of the way in which KDE can be configured, I have, for some time, arranged my desktop to have all these features. I do this by adding a blank panel, which for me, goes along the top of the screen. I shift the panel to the left side and add the applications that I most frequently access. I change the "More Settings" so that "Windows can cover". The attached graphics illustrate this action of covering and uncovering as well as the option to have a larger icon. My desktop background image changes every 5 minutes through a file of selected photos that I have taken.

I am sure that other changes can be made to the KDE desktop if you want it to look more like Unity.

[oshunluvr]

Yeah, that's pretty much what I remember. I primarily use a desktop and it's occasionally shared so I see the log in manager on occasion. I like the single screen look much better, but like you said - it's not that big of a deal. I just haven't seen a need to switch back to KDM so I stayed with the slightly better looking LightDM.

[SteveRiley]

It wasn't that it caused "problems" in the past, it just never displayed correct (IMO). With LightDM, the log in menu follows the active screen (mouse cursor). With KDM, it would only display on one screen which would be fine except sometimes the log in screen would switch (not often and randomly). What I would really like is the ability to control whether or not the second screen activates at all and ultimately to be able to have a different image on the second (third, fourth) screens.

At the office, my T520 sits on a dock with its lid closed. Connected to the dock, via DisplayPort, are two 22" monitors. When the computer boots, the KDM login dialog appears on both. I don't know of any way to configure the login to appear on only one monitor, nor to configure separate KDM wallpapers. But since KDM lasts all of two seconds while I enter my password, I don't really need lots of configuration.

[verndog]

Like it or not Ubuntu has a lot of media coverage and if somebody is going to support something linux-wise, it is probably going to be Ubuntu. Currently kubuntu and the other *buntu's benefit from the efforts that others put in to make things work with Ubuntu. It is likely that Ubuntu's support in the market (free or otherwise) will continue, however, the further away from debian it moves, then the less benefit it will provide to the *buntus if they are based off of debian.

I think it is more likely that once Canonical gets Unity Next and it's other projects where they want them, then all of these seemingly wild changes will settle down. All of this change isn't in their best interest for their own development either.

The real issue is how successful will Wayland be? With Gnome and KDE 4 both moving towards it, it has a good chance of success. Most likely somebody will move the various other window managers once it is established. At that point the question will be whether X.org will continue to be developed or not (granted that might be years, look how long COBOL has been around).

My point being is that it might be premature to dump Ubuntu as a base and switch to debian because the Wayland/Mir. It would be better to wait and see how Wayland works out. Who knows, maybe Ubuntu is right about Mir (but I doubt it).
In terms of display servers, even debian will be faced with a choice eventually. If they are going to support Gnome 3 and KDE 4, they will need to support Wayland.

I totally agree. If Kubuntu moves away from Canonical then it will no longer be Kubuntu but some sort of hybrid at best. I do however agree that Wayland may be a better fit, but Mir isn't even out in its first release, nor Wayland for that matter. I know about the beta offers, but I'm referring to a more mature product.

It will take a couple of releases for this to all pan out. Remember KDE3 and all the fallout over KDE4. Unity over Gnome2. I hated Unity but now that it has matured a bit, I use it over Gnome.

All those Gnome2 look a likes will fade into the sunset, just like Gene Autry ... Happy trails everone!

[oshunluvr]

It wasn't that it caused "problems" in the past, it just never displayed correct (IMO). With LightDM, the log in menu follows the active screen (mouse cursor). With KDM, it would only display on one screen which would be fine except sometimes the log in screen would switch (not often and randomly). What I would really like is the ability to control whether or not the second screen activates at all and ultimately to be able to have a different image on the second (third, fourth) screens.

[Buddlespit]

That explains the dearth of information out there about it

Does KDM support dual monitors correctly (in a configurable way) yet? That's the only reason I stayed with LightDM.

I'm running my desktop on Kubuntu 13.04 and KDM. It's dual-monitor set up for Xinerama, 3200x900. I don't have any problems.

[oshunluvr]

LightDM is developed and sponsored by Canonical

That explains the dearth of information out there about it

Does KDM support dual monitors correctly (in a configurable way) yet? That's the only reason I stayed with LightDM.

[SteveRiley]

LightDM is developed and sponsored by Canonical. Anyone who wants to work on the project must sign Canonical's Contributor Agreement, which requires forfeiting of copyright.

http://www.canonical.com/contributors

I'm not aware of any non-*buntu distro that ships LightDM as the default display manager.