I give up

[ardvark71]

Re: I give up

IF PCs were required to be shipped with OS neutral hardware and no OS installed, Microsoft would loose half of their desktop market share and ALL of their server share immediately.

Hi GreyGeek...

Perhaps. But I'm curious how that would all play out in the market in terms of American consumers being faced with installing their own OS's. Many, if not most, do not understand or have the skills to perform this. I wouldn't object to receiving the jobs that would come with a OS neutral option but I'm wondering how consumers would react to the inconvenience and extra charges that would come with this system. It's possible the PC market would decline to some extent as it would be likely we would see some migration to Apple (just a guess.) Paying to have their PC's repaired is something I have found most people do not like to do and will pursue other options in the hopes of getting it done for free, many times with unintended consequences.

Regards...

[ardvark71]

Re: I give up

The reason that Windows kicks our butts is because they give the appearance that everything is easy. We will kick their butts the instant we give up making everything a test of manhood and make our stuff just as easy.

Hi...

Very true

However, I wouldn't say that Microsoft gives Windows the appearance of everything being easy, in many cases, it flat out is.

Regards...

[GreyGeek]

Re: I give up

Yesterday I wrote Reply #27. Today, I open my browser and what do I see?

While corporations can gang up on consumers, the SCOTUS says the reverse isn't legal.

Then I encounter the unsurprising news that:

Federal regulators have been working closely with the nuclear power industry to keep the nation's aging reactors operating within safety standards by repeatedly weakening those standards, or simply failing to enforce them, an investigation by The Associated Press has found.

Time after time, officials at the U.S. Nuclear Regulatory Commission have decided that original regulations were too strict, arguing that safety margins could be eased without peril, according to records and interviews.

The result? Rising fears that these accommodations by the NRC are significantly undermining safety — and inching the reactors closer to an accident that could harm the public and jeopardize the future of nuclear power in the United States.

Examples abound....

and you can read on to realize that there are not just isolated examples, but evidence of overwhelming collusion between the NRC and the nuclear power industry to maintain profits at the risk of peoples lives.

You may not be aware that the Missouri River from Sioux City, Ne, to its joining with the Mississippi is in a flood event that many predict will last until this December. Seventy miles North East of my home is the Fort Calhoun Nuclear power plant, setting right on the banks of the Missouri River. It is a carbon copy of the Fukushima nuclear power plant and is now surrounded by flood waters. According to the NRC there was a fire at the plant on June 8th in the electrical cabinet that shut down the pumps feeding cooling water to the spent fuel rods pool. The Omaha Public Power District tried to dispel Internet "rumors" about the safety of the plant.

In April, OPPD asked for a no fly zone over the plant because they shut down the reactor for routine refueling the privately owned nuclear facility officials have stated.

Others suggest that the no-fly zone is to prevent coverage of the dangers the water surrounding the plant continues to pose, as flood levels are predicted to rise even higher as the eight foot snow packs in Wyoming and Montana began melting when the late summer fully arrives. To my knowledge they've never put up a no-fly zone around the plant during previous refuelings and pictures at a distance make it hard to evaluate:
[img width=400 height=266]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-4TcZh6MdADo/Tfg7WvDeN0I/AAAAAAAAEE4/LHGMItWwZbU/s640/Fort+Calhoun+Nuclear+Power+Plant.jpg[/img]
but the water level at the plant is above the height of the stop signs on roads around the plant. Other photos are at that website where that photo was linked from. Here is another view, taken from what appears to be an almost illegal position:
[img width=400 height=264]http://www.omaha.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Site=OW&Date=20110617&Category=NEWS01&ArtNo= 706179913&Ref=AR&maxw=600&maxh=400[/img]

You can see a video of the plant taken this week end here. As you can see in the video, which shows just a small portion of the flooding around Fort Calhoun, the flooding is extensive and stretches from Sioux City to the Mississippi. Huge disaster, even ignoring the potential of a nuclear disaster at Fort Calhoun.

About 70 miles to the South East of my home is the Cooper Nuclear station, which was also put under a no-fly restriction even though it is not refueling nor has it had a problem yet. It is not of the Fucushima class. But, yesterday morning, the Missouri came within 18 inches of disaster and heavy rains this week and week end are threatening to make the 903 foot above sea level possible. Photo of the Cooper nuclear station are here.

It is inconceivable that it may be better that the levees above Fort Calhoun and Cooper break, flooding the surrounding country side so that water levels at the nuclear plants can remain below the levels which would flood the rooms containing the electrical pumps that keep the spent fuel cool in the cooling ponds. Flooded land will dry out and eventually new crops can be planted, homes replaced and lives continue. But, water filled with radioactive waste flooding the country side and washing into the Missouri and hence the Mississippi, contaminating them from Fort Calhoun to the Gulf would be a disaster of MAJOR proportions. But, there it is. The inconceivable possibly being the most desirable.

[MAHillsgrove]

Re: I give up

However, I wouldn't say that Microsoft gives Windows the appearance of everything being easy, in many cases, it flat out is.


Is it? I hate dealing with it because problems are so difficult and often so deadly. Windows is fragile, but less so in a virtual environment. It is the most self destructive OS made.

At least I can reload Linux without personal permission from Bill Gates and crew.

[ardvark71]

Re: I give up

Is it?

Yes.

I can count on less than one hand how many times I've been able to install something successfully from a tarball, this game serving as one example. In contrast, I have rarely have had any problems with MSI under Windows.

Regards...

[GreyGeek]

Re: I give up

Is it?

Yes.

I can count on less than one hand how many times I've been able to install something successfully from a tarball, this game serving as one example.

It depends on what is in the tar ball. IF it is a recently compiled ELF binary the odds are that it will install and run just fine. If it is source code the standard mantra "may" help, but only if your libraries are compatible with the libraries against which it was originally written.

In contrast, I have rarely have had any problems with MSI under Windows.

Neither have several million viruses and Trojans...

[ardvark71]

Re: I give up

Neither have several million viruses and Trojans...

Well, I wasn't counting that....

Regards...

[GreyGeek]

Re: I give up

Most people don't.

It's sort of like Windows users having to reboot to restore stability (not so much of a problem with XPSP3 or Win7SP1). Just like smokers who light up another cigarette while they have two or three others burning away in the ash tray. They have to do it so often they fail to realize HOW OFTEN they do it. It's become automatic and transparent. Just like they lose track of how many viruses they get notifications on.

[blobfish]

Re: I give up

I can count on less than one hand how many times I've been able to install something successfully from a tarball, this game serving as one example. In contrast, I have rarely have had any problems with MSI under Windows.

you are comparing apples to oranges. If windows programs were distributed via source, you would have as much if not more trouble than on linux. A better comparison would be a windows .msi to a debian .deb. I have never had a software installation experience that even comes close to the ubuntu repos.

you can go to lauchpad and file a bug(wish) to have something added to the repos.

[ardvark71]

Re: I give up

If windows programs were distributed via source, you would have as much if not more trouble than on linux. A better comparison would be a windows .msi to a debian .deb.

Excellent point, thank you.

Regards...

[sithlord48]

Re: I give up

I can count on less than one hand how many times I've been able to install something successfully from a tarball, this game serving as one example. In contrast, I have rarely have had any problems with MSI under Windows.

you are comparing apples to oranges. If windows programs were distributed via source, you would have as much if not more trouble than on linux. A better comparison would be a windows .msi to a debian .deb. I have never had a software installation experience that even comes close to the ubuntu repos.

you can go to lauchpad and file a bug(wish) to have something added to the repos.

lol that is exacly the point i was going to make.
[mini rant]
im a developer who makes Qt based stuff,now my stuff doesn't have use for most ppl but in order to make life ez for my fellow *buntu users i have set up a ppa to install/update its ez to add the ppa
[code=to add repo]
sudo add-apt-repository ppa:sithlord48/ff7
[/code]
ok well that covers *BUNTU users ONLY. do you have a ubuntu based or debian based system well then you have to goto my PPA and manually add the repos addy to your sources.list file (still not to bad.) , but what about non debian based linuxes this is where it gets tricky for us,well i guess they could use something like alien to make my deb their native package type,do they even have such a thing? so now i also have to distribute a tarball that will allow you to install it reguardless of linux type so i make a generic install tarball generic tar ball (Ardvark71 plz try and let me know if you find hard to use) the generic installer is geared to make things as ez as possible w/o using the package system at all.(there is a kdialog based script and a "safe" text based one) there is also a sourcetar ball (that i send to the ppa to make the debs) others could use this to make packages for their distros.the source tar is what i would distrubute if i were not makeing packages myself. (like most programmers working on linux projects)

Now why am i explaing this? well the main point is that linux is deverise its our strong point(more use cases) and our weak point(packaging) . even my generic installer has dependices, you need to have either kdesudo + kdialog or just a shell enviroment. also doing it this way you have to manually install dependcies (libQtcore and libQtgui are needed) since idk your distro or what your packages should be called or for sure where they are placed (not all follow the standards) for it to run after install. i also make the installer for windows and mac os. they are not deverified at all so its then a case of one installer to rule them all there is not a need to consider other types of systems at all.
look at the project stats if i weren't a linux user myself i would just make a windows installer Stats(1 yr avg)
[/mini rant]

[perspectoff]

Re: I give up

Yes, I use Dolphin as the root-level sudo user all the time.

I even made a menu item that will prompt me for the sudo password:

kdesu dolphin

While in it I can do all the manipulation of a root user from a GUI interface. Further, when I open a file from Dolphin in this way, I do so with root privileges. For example, opening a text file opens it as the root user (i.e. kate, my default text editor, is started as the root user), so that editing/saving a file with root permissions is automatic.

I placed this menu item in my panel bar, since I use it so much.

Not particularly difficult. Kdesu can be used to start any application with root-level privileges, actually.

Every OS has a learning curve. Heck, going from XP to Vista/7 is the hardest thing in life for many users, and now they only have 3 more years to make the switch to Linux instead!

[Teunis]

Re: I give up

Be careful running KDE applications as sudo, you might end up with broken system files.
A lot of them are better served with kdesudo.

Besides, the times you need root privileges are so rare it's not worth the additional risk of running something like Dolphin that has net access as root.
I have installed the 'Root Actions' menu add-on of Sam Rog 131 and it gives me all the flexibility I could wish for by right-clicking the file or directory.
https://launchpad.net/~samrog131/+ar...+build/2207789

[blobfish]

Re: I give up

im a developer who makes Qt based stuff.... but what about non debian based linuxes this is where it gets tricky for us.

I am a fan of Qt also and yes trying to be all things to every platform is difficult to say the least. I have high hopes for cmake. http://www.cmake.org/Wiki/CMake:Packaging_With_CPack